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To: jwz@netscape.com
Date: Mon, 3 Jun 1996 09:42:32 -0700
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In-Reply-To: <31AEE9BD.59E2@netscape.com>
Subject: RE[4]: your generated HTML
Organization: Netscape Communications Corporation, Mozilla Division
X-Mailer: Emissary V2.00, by Attachmate Corp.
Content-Type: multipart/related;
boundary="=_03tW34g.bO1996u.N16d000A.r06Y.42:0047e7";
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<HTML><HEAD>
<TITLE>RE[4]: your generated HTML</TITLE>
<META NAME=3D"GENERATOR" CONTENT=3D"Emissary 2.0">
</HEAD><BODY>
<BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>> >2: your fixed-width text is *larger* t=
han the default size for fixed-</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>> > width text, and since the default s=
ize of my window is 80 fixed-</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>> > width columns wide, I actually lose=
2-3 columns off the end of each</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>> > of your lines.</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>> ></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>> This is really the receivers problem not t=
he senders.</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>Total nonsense.</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<TT><FONT COLOR=3D"#ff0000">I do not appreciate your response here! </FO=
NT></TT><BR>
<TT>If you continue with this type of response then I will not be </TT><B=
R>
<TT>talking to you again.</TT><P>
<TT>If you read the MIME spec (NOT THE HTML spec), then you will see that=
</TT><BR>
<TT>display (including line length) is the receiver's problem. </TT><BR>
<TT>I am talking about Email not the Web. Just because HTML is sent in a
</TT><BR>
<TT>mail message does not change the mail ground rules.</TT><P>
<TT>If the sender choses to write lines longer than 80 columns then the <=
/TT><BR>
<TT>receiving client should be smart enought to display that text without
loosing anything.</TT><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<P>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>By using a "standard" line length but a larger =
font, you're</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>guarenteeing that anyone with a "standard" size=
d window will lose,</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>unless they ignore your markup.</FONT></TT></B>=
<BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<TT>NO I am not. Only those people with less than capable clients will</=
TT><BR>
<TT>lose. I am tired of having to deal with broken or less featured</TT>=
<BR>
<TT>receiving clients. You could tailor and restrict the HTML you genera=
te</TT><BR>
<TT>in Mail, but we will let the user have full control. If he gets in</=
TT><BR>
<TT>trouble then its his problem. The sending user will learn over time.=
</TT><P>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>I'm not saying that the composer shouldn't be a=
ble to control this</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>stuff, I'm just saying that the HTML you sent i=
s ugly. Those are very</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>different statements.</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<TT>I would think that ugly is a subjective point of view. You think it =
is</TT><BR>
<TT>ugly then fine. But that is just you and others may not think so. P=
lus</TT><BR>
<TT>its up to the sending user what format he choses. He could make it l=
ook</TT><BR>
<TT>just fine by your standards.</TT><P>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>tags. The rest of it is gimickry for its own s=
ake, and it doesn't</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>come free.</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<TT>I find it very hard to believe that you said this. There is a bunch<=
/TT><BR>
<TT>of stuff that can be done in HTML with images in MAIL that cannot be =
done</TT><BR>
<TT>in standard MIME. "It doesn't come free", what in the world are you<=
/TT><BR>
<TT>talking about. </TT><P>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2> >But hey, you're welcome to generate ugly HT=
ML in your product. </FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>I'm sure your users will vote with their feet..=
.</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<TT>Again this is totally uncalled for. I have tried to hold a conversat=
ion</TT><BR>
<TT>with you so that mail readers in general can handle HTML in mail. Si=
nce</TT><BR>
<TT>Netscape has the market share it has I believe that interoperation wi=
th</TT><BR>
<TT>you guys is important. </TT><P>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>Nobody's telling web page authors that they can=
't make their pages look</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>any way they like. But as yourself, when's the=
last time you saw a web</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>page that looked like your message? With fixed=
-width fonts? With some</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>fonts that were so small as to be unreadable? =
That looked really bad</FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>if your window wasn't exactly the right size?</=
FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>></FONT></TT></B><BR>
<B><TT><FONT SIZE=3D2>>-- </FONT></TT></B><BR>
<TT>Now this is total nonsense. Who cares ? Its all about giving the se=
nding</TT><BR>
<TT>user all the control he can get. If he (me in this case) composes "u=
gly"</TT><BR>
<TT>HTML then it is his personal business. Just as long as the sending u=
ser</TT><BR>
<TT>has the tools he needs to construct what he wants.</TT><BR>
<BR><P align=3Dleft><IMG src=3D"cid:0.19960603164233.izzy@scr.atm.com" al=
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